Doncaster Park & Ride (Read 2,557 times)

[townlines]

Not sure if any of you have read the article yet from the Yorkshire Post, but it is certainly a very damning article towards SYPTE and the Government, for wasting £20m of taxpayers money, to build a Park & Ride site that no one uses. The Mayor of Doncaster, Peter Davies, said the following quote, "My plan would be to scrap the bus lanes and open them to cars."

What are your personal thoughts on the Doncaster Park & Ride sites?

Full Story below,

It cost £20m to build, has 800 parking spaces and was supposed to cut congestion and make life easier for people who live in suburban streets which are choked by commuter traffic. But Doncaster's park and ride scheme attracts only about 100 cars on its busiest days, and a Yorkshire Post investigation has confirmed it is often running at a tiny fraction of its capacity.

Misgivings were voiced about the town's "quality bus corridor" project before work on its construction even began and the shock new figures have led to it being slammed as a "ludicrous waste of money". The scheme has 400 spaces at a southern base and 400 to the north of Doncaster town centre. But figures held by the South Yorkshire Passenger Transport Executive (SYPTE), which runs both car parks, show only a handful of those spaces are used daily – often fewer than a tenth of those available.

Statistics obtained by the Yorkshire Post show that on a busy day about 95 cars arrive in the south and about 50 in the north, while on quiet days fewer than 30 can be expected at both. Numbers are particularly low for the northern site, at Green Lane, Woodlands, where daily car figures have been as low as 19 and usage rarely breaks through the 60-a-day barrier.

As part of the QBC, an inbound bus lane was also built on the A638, with the southern stretch on Bawtry Road through the suburb of Bessacarr, and the northbound on York Road to Woodlands. The project has been unpopular with residents who live along the route, and Doncaster's Mayor Peter Davies, who lives close to the southern bus lane, has vowed to "review" it. The QBC scheme was supported by previous Mayor Martin Winter and opened on September 1, 2008. Parking is free and return tickets to town cost £2 for adults or £10 for a week.

Mr Davies said the new figures bore out his suspicions the park and ride scheme was "the most colossal white elephant" and a "monument to Labour incompetence and profligacy. It is a ludicrous waste of money, and the people who have wasted it should be ashamed of themselves. I am actually surprised that the figures are as high as they are. It is just not convenient for people to use buses in Doncaster, and whichever way you look at it this has been a complete disaster. My plan would be to scrap the bus lanes and open them to cars."

Mr Davies said at present that would not be possible without "serious ramifications" for future Government funding for the town, because Westminster paid £15m towards the project. But he added if there is a change of Government this year, he may attempt to persuade a new Conservative administration the project should be reversed.

Mr Davies' comments were echoed by Geoff Bennett, a member of the Bessacarr and Cantley Forum, who said he was "not surprised" so few people were using park and ride. Mr Bennett added: "I think these figures are optimistic, and from the point of view of people living in this area, the whole QBC project has been a complete waste of time and money. There is a dedicated service which runs on the route during the day, and the general impression people have is that every single bus is empty and this is infuriating as you watch them go through. The scheme was also supposed to improve congestion along the route, but you would not notice any difference. The road is still heavily congested and it appears to be of no benefit whatsoever."

First South Yorkshire, which operates the park and ride buses and invested more than £3m in a new fleet for the project, said bus priorities must be "maintained and retained" to give the project the best chance of growth. Deputy managing director Brandon Jones said First remained committed to the scheme despite slow growth. "It is growing in terms of popularity and we expect that it will continue to grow in the future. These types of project do need time to build but we believe that once people experience it, they will want to use it. Perhaps there may be an argument that marketing needs more consideration, but we believe it is a very good product and we are keen to work with the council and the transport executive."

Monthly statistics show there has been some increase in patronage and transport officials say usage has tripled, but admit this is from a "low base" and only involves very small numbers. Sales figures show the Woodlands site achieved sales worth £1,107 in the entire month of November, while the more popular southern site achieved sales of £2,691.

Despite this, David Brown, director general of SYPTE said: "The park and ride sites in Doncaster are a valuable addition to the public transport offer. "Last month was the busiest month yet. During 2010 we hope that trend will continue upwards and even more people will take advantage of the chance of free parking at either of the two car parks and the convenience of catching the bus into town."

RUNNING ON NEAR ENOUGH EMPTY

Average daily car figures for Doncaster park and ride (400 spaces available at each site every day) for 2009. December statistics are not available at this time.

Month	North	South
January	24	42
February	22	43
March	23	47
April	21	44
May	21	42
June	26	49
July	25	49
August	22	44
September	25	54
October	28	55
November	35	62
December	N/A	N/A

Yorkshire Post article:- www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/Exclusive-Taxpayers-taken-for-a.5962948.jp

[Tom B]

Again, perhaps if the bus service were better, more people would use it.

If you are trundling on your merry way into town on a cold morning, would you want to park up on the edge of town, to catch a late, busy, grubby bus?

Perhaps the £20 million would have been better spent improving the bus service such that people make a conscious decision to use it.

[ryansf]

From what I see in the figures, it looks like steady growth to me. While I'm not disagreeing with what the paper says, I'm sure if the same had happened in Leeds (money spent, no one using it), nothing would be said at all!

[asourdirective]

The North site should never of been built where it is - it is effectively competing with Adwick & Bentley railway stations, whose car parks are near full, despite only recently been extended. Although the service from the two train sites is not as frequent, the reliability and the cost (half the price) is far better than the bus service to the North Park & Ride.

[dougie]

Jan 9, 2010 1:34:16 GMT Tom B said:

If you are trundling on your merry way into town on a cold morning, would you want to park up on the edge of town, to catch a late, busy, grubby bus?

Tom, usually I agree with you, but to describe the 638 as "busy" is taking things too far

The only good thing about the Doncaster Park & Ride is that it meant Olive Grove got rid of a handful of cursed B7Ls to use on the 638 (before the route got brand new buses)

[mainline]

Anyone happen to know if there are any "official" passenger figures out there for the 638 Park & Ride service?

[tox0114]

Jan 9, 2010 0:47:11 GMT townlines said:

Not sure if any of you have read the article yet from the Yorkshire Post, but it is certainly a very damning article towards SYPTE and the Government, for wasting £20m of taxpayers money, to build a Park & Ride site that no one uses. The Mayor of Doncaster, Peter Davies, said the following quote, "My plan would be to scrap the bus lanes and open them to cars."

What are your personal thoughts on the Doncaster Park & Ride sites?

Full Story below,

It cost £20m to build, has 800 parking spaces and was supposed to cut congestion and make life easier for people who live in suburban streets which are choked by commuter traffic. But Doncaster's park and ride scheme attracts only about 100 cars on its busiest days, and a Yorkshire Post investigation has confirmed it is often running at a tiny fraction of its capacity.

Misgivings were voiced about the town's "quality bus corridor" project before work on its construction even began and the shock new figures have led to it being slammed as a "ludicrous waste of money". The scheme has 400 spaces at a southern base and 400 to the north of Doncaster town centre. But figures held by the South Yorkshire Passenger Transport Executive (SYPTE), which runs both car parks, show only a handful of those spaces are used daily – often fewer than a tenth of those available.

Statistics obtained by the Yorkshire Post show that on a busy day about 95 cars arrive in the south and about 50 in the north, while on quiet days fewer than 30 can be expected at both. Numbers are particularly low for the northern site, at Green Lane, Woodlands, where daily car figures have been as low as 19 and usage rarely breaks through the 60-a-day barrier.

As part of the QBC, an inbound bus lane was also built on the A638, with the southern stretch on Bawtry Road through the suburb of Bessacarr, and the northbound on York Road to Woodlands. The project has been unpopular with residents who live along the route, and Doncaster's Mayor Peter Davies, who lives close to the southern bus lane, has vowed to "review" it. The QBC scheme was supported by previous Mayor Martin Winter and opened on September 1, 2008. Parking is free and return tickets to town cost £2 for adults or £10 for a week.

Mr Davies said the new figures bore out his suspicions the park and ride scheme was "the most colossal white elephant" and a "monument to Labour incompetence and profligacy. It is a ludicrous waste of money, and the people who have wasted it should be ashamed of themselves. I am actually surprised that the figures are as high as they are. It is just not convenient for people to use buses in Doncaster, and whichever way you look at it this has been a complete disaster. My plan would be to scrap the bus lanes and open them to cars."

Mr Davies said at present that would not be possible without "serious ramifications" for future Government funding for the town, because Westminster paid £15m towards the project. But he added if there is a change of Government this year, he may attempt to persuade a new Conservative administration the project should be reversed.

Mr Davies' comments were echoed by Geoff Bennett, a member of the Bessacarr and Cantley Forum, who said he was "not surprised" so few people were using park and ride. Mr Bennett added: "I think these figures are optimistic, and from the point of view of people living in this area, the whole QBC project has been a complete waste of time and money. There is a dedicated service which runs on the route during the day, and the general impression people have is that every single bus is empty and this is infuriating as you watch them go through. The scheme was also supposed to improve congestion along the route, but you would not notice any difference. The road is still heavily congested and it appears to be of no benefit whatsoever."

First South Yorkshire, which operates the park and ride buses and invested more than £3m in a new fleet for the project, said bus priorities must be "maintained and retained" to give the project the best chance of growth. Deputy managing director Brandon Jones said First remained committed to the scheme despite slow growth. "It is growing in terms of popularity and we expect that it will continue to grow in the future. These types of project do need time to build but we believe that once people experience it, they will want to use it. Perhaps there may be an argument that marketing needs more consideration, but we believe it is a very good product and we are keen to work with the council and the transport executive."

Monthly statistics show there has been some increase in patronage and transport officials say usage has tripled, but admit this is from a "low base" and only involves very small numbers. Sales figures show the Woodlands site achieved sales worth £1,107 in the entire month of November, while the more popular southern site achieved sales of £2,691.

Despite this, David Brown, director general of SYPTE said: "The park and ride sites in Doncaster are a valuable addition to the public transport offer. "Last month was the busiest month yet. During 2010 we hope that trend will continue upwards and even more people will take advantage of the chance of free parking at either of the two car parks and the convenience of catching the bus into town."

RUNNING ON NEAR ENOUGH EMPTY

Average daily car figures for Doncaster park and ride (400 spaces available at each site every day) for 2009. December statistics are not available at this time.

Month	North	South
January	24	42
February	22	43
March	23	47
April	21	44
May	21	42
June	26	49
July	25	49
August	22	44
September	25	54
October	28	55
November	35	62
December	N/A	N/A

Yorkshire Post article:- www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/Exclusive-Taxpayers-taken-for-a.5962948.jp

Spot on that from Peter Davies. I must say, he does talk common sense and the SYITA seem to now have a personal vendetta against his and branding him as "anti-bus" and the like. Have to say, I actually agree with everything that he has said.

The thing is though with Doncaster unlike other places which have Park & Ride sites, the town centre has ample amounts of car parking spaces and to reach the Park & Ride sites, you already have to drive nearly into the centre of Doncaster to make use of them.

By the way how is the Doncaster NHS Park & Ride scheme going? Could the Woodlands site and possibly the Parotts Corner site not also be used for this too?

[moonraker79]

Jan 15, 2010 20:34:48 GMT tox0114 said:

By the way how is the Doncaster NHS Park & Ride scheme going?

Considering there's little (If any!) advertising then it's doing quite well.

[tmt]

And these are the same people that want to bring Park & Ride sites to Barnsley and Rotherham also! The Park & Ride sites for the Supertram in Sheffield, including those not owned or operated by SYPTE (Valley Centertainment) seem to do very well and when the BRT is launched on the Sheffield Parkway, I'm sure this new 1,000 space Park & Ride scheme in Rotherham will also do well, for both commuters to Rotherham and Sheffield.

[30563]

What is the "Doncaster NHS Park & Ride"? Don't recall seeing anything about it before.

[Tom B]

Jan 18, 2010 20:32:12 GMT 30563 said:

What is the "Doncaster NHS Park & Ride"? Don't recall seeing anything about it before.

It's been mentioned before, if you grep the forum...

[tmt]

Forgot to mention Sheffield in my above post too. The Wadsley Bridge site on the former Bowling Alley. By the time people from Junction 36 of the M1 have driven down into Wadsley Bridge, they may as well just continue driving into Sheffield! It would be the same failure as the Doncaster North Park & Ride scheme.

Park & Ride schemes only seem to work when there is not sufficient parking spaces within the centre. Doncaster and likewise Doncaster doesn't suffer from this and has plenty of car parking spaces within both centres.

[donnytom]

Doncaster's spaces will be reduced when they build the Civic and Cultural Quarter over the old college car park. At 70p per hour, this also happens to be the cheaper of the car parks. Some of the other spaces are more expensive- NCP and Frenchgate ones in particular.

If the 638 stopped at all stops and could provide £2 return, maybe people would use it then.

Doncaster NHS P+R operates from "Car Park A"- opposite the race course, between Town Moor Avenue and the old fire station. It is operated by Veolia on behalf of Doncaster PCT. DMBC and SYPTE are not involved, which is why it has not been publicised much. The service is completely free to use, and caters for a lack of space at DRI. They are considering further P+R schemes. Link to DRI website:

www.dbh.nhs.uk/Park_and_Ride.asp

[bernardf]

www.forum.sy-transport.co.uk/index.cgi?action=gotopost&board=buses&thread=11126&post=96001

This was last March. Sorry to read that use has not increased.

[unhappybunny]

I believe you should pay per car rather than per passenger. This would encourage more people to car-pool and families to travel at a weekend.

Last year I used a P&R at Canterbury. It was the best P&R I have used. It was very easy to find and well sign-posted and it cost £2.50 per car per day. You got a ticket from the in barrier at the car park and showed it on the bus and everyone got on the bus for nothing. The bus ran every 10 minutes from the car park to the city centre, ours didn't stop at all on the way out or return. When you returned you paid for the parking at the pay machine @£2.50 per day.. easy! Or £2 a day for regular users.

www.canterbury.gov.uk/main.cfm?objectid=839

TSY should take note of systems that DO work, and ask what they are doing wrong!