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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2013 17:05:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2013 17:48:15 GMT
they didn.t ask me what I thought and I use them every day, fares are about the cheapest in the country, the trains may not be pretty but they're reliable, punctual and most are comfortable for the 40 minutes I spend on them.
I doubt if most of the general public actually know whos train they are on anyway
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Post by lysander on Jun 25, 2013 19:27:27 GMT
Not the latest models by a long way but experience of them is that they are reliable. Perhaps I am now so used to travelling on them that I don't find fault ( except the rattle traps which should all be scrapped)but when the franchise didn't envisage any new rolling stock it's difficult to see what more Northernrail can do...operating the oldest stuff on the network, as they do.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2013 19:44:42 GMT
They have had recent issues, such as Hatfield & the winter weather which obviously has an effect on punctuality/performance. The Trains are overall not bad, the 142's are awful, but what can they do about these, perhaps a refurb would help. The 158's though on the Sheffield to Leeds via Barnsley express are rather nice on the interior, they have been refubed & it shows as it is a more pleasant experience.
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Post by rich on Jun 25, 2013 22:01:16 GMT
Public been very harsh. Could go back to Arriva operating them then they'd see that Northern are excellent. I never had a major gripe about themto be honest.
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Post by duncan on Jun 26, 2013 1:44:05 GMT
Sorry but Hatfield has not prevented them from cleaning their trains. Just because they are old it does not excuse them from being Filthy.
People are quick to criticise buses for being dirty then sit on a filthy train and say nothing because they are old.
I am not the only one to think so as they are regularly pulled up by WYPTE over this very matter. |
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Post by lv426 on Jun 26, 2013 6:47:27 GMT
....fares are about the cheapest in the country.... Really? Not outside the PTE areas. Sheffield - Lincoln day return £13.70. About 48 miles each way. Usually on a 142. (There isn't any "off peak" option here). Compare to Plymouth - Penzance at £9.50, around 77 miles, and you may even get to ride an HST. Even using a DUO it still works out dearer. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2013 23:29:17 GMT
I don't think the country is been harsh, not surprising at all. Can anyone suggest an operator which could possibly be worse?
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Post by lysander on Jul 6, 2013 7:50:30 GMT
Only the one who had the franchise some years ago!
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Post by alemaster on Jul 6, 2013 13:25:16 GMT
Sorry but Hatfield has not prevented them from cleaning their trains. Just because they are old it does not excuse them from being Filthy.
People are quick to criticise buses for being dirty then sit on a filthy train and say nothing because they are old.
I am not the only one to think so as they are regularly pulled up by WYPTE over this very matter.Dirty? Really? Units that finish their day at main locations like Sheffield get cleaned inside and outside every night. And have rubbish picked and bins emptied regularly during the day. If you said scruffy & worn out rather than dirty then I would agree. Just compare a Northern 158 with an East Midlands Trains 158, which has had a full refurbishment and overhaul. |
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Post by alemaster on Jul 6, 2013 13:35:26 GMT
I can understand why people have ranked Northern lowly though, I don't think this reflects on the staff and management though, more the DfT.
Northern run a generally reliable service. Its a very basic one, no frills, using worn out old trains, but mostly do get you from A to B on time.
Really a lot of money needs to be putting in to the rolling stock, capacity and perhaps new or more frequent services. The longer distance limited stop services like Nottingham to Leeds and Sheffield to Hull could do with an upgrade to a more Intercity like service (reservations and catering trolley maybe?). Routes like Sheffield to Lincoln - a key Intercity connection - could do with a regular express service rather than just a rural all stations service.
But the Northern franchise are just an odd collection of rural and commuter routes that no one else wants and need subsidising. The franchise was let on a no growth basis, at the time of letting the franchise there was talk of bustitution at off peak times to reduce the subsidy required. However there has been lots of growth and Northern have managed to get funding for extra carriages and various other initiatives to try and help cope and they should be credited for this. The fact is the DfT didn't quite get it right and the system is creaking.
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Post by duncan on Jul 6, 2013 14:11:26 GMT
Sorry but Hatfield has not prevented them from cleaning their trains. Just because they are old it does not excuse them from being Filthy.
People are quick to criticise buses for being dirty then sit on a filthy train and say nothing because they are old.
I am not the only one to think so as they are regularly pulled up by WYPTE over this very matter.Dirty? Really? Units that finish their day at main locations like Sheffield get cleaned inside and outside every night. And have rubbish picked and bins emptied regularly during the day. If you said scruffy & worn out rather than dirty then I would agree. Just compare a Northern 158 with an East Midlands Trains 158, which has had a full refurbishment and overhaul. As has been stated many times by myself and others, their trains suffer from decades of ground in filth that could be removed with a proper deep clean. But is not. Picking up litter does not remove the deep seated grime underneath it. Do they need a refurb? No they just need a damn good clean from top to bottom. One train that was SPECIALLY PREPARED for a WYPTE inspection was refused by the PTE as being unfit for service. They do not seem to grasp the difference between sweeping trains and cleaning them. |
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Post by duncan on Jul 6, 2013 14:15:00 GMT
Sorry but Hatfield has not prevented them from cleaning their trains. Just because they are old it does not excuse them from being Filthy.
People are quick to criticise buses for being dirty then sit on a filthy train and say nothing because they are old.
I am not the only one to think so as they are regularly pulled up by WYPTE over this very matter.Dirty? Really? Units that finish their day at main locations like Sheffield get cleaned inside and outside every night. And have rubbish picked and bins emptied regularly during the day. If you said scruffy Just compare a Northern 158 with an East Midlands Trains 158, which has had a full refurbishment and overhaul. Scruffy is another word for dirty. 158?? would not know one if it ran me over but I do know ground in dirt that is tolerated instead of cleaned. |
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Post by duncan on Jul 6, 2013 14:18:37 GMT
I don't think the country is been harsh, not surprising at all. Can anyone suggest an operator which could possibly be worse? Lots of people are quick to slag Arriva but look at their operations now. Very well run with clean stock. Arriva suffered from taking tenders over from another that had gone in too low, they had the sense to tender more realistically but were undercut by Northern who obviously tendered on the basis of never cleaning trains properly. |
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sweb
Driver
Posts: 383
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Post by sweb on Jul 6, 2013 18:04:20 GMT
Sorry but Hatfield has not prevented them from cleaning their trains. Just because they are old it does not excuse them from being Filthy.
People are quick to criticise buses for being dirty then sit on a filthy train and say nothing because they are old.
I am not the only one to think so as they are regularly pulled up by WYPTE over this very matter.Dirty? Really? Units that finish their day at main locations like Sheffield get cleaned inside and outside every night. And have rubbish picked and bins emptied regularly during the day. If you said scruffy & worn out rather than dirty then I would agree. Just compare a Northern 158 with an East Midlands Trains 158, which has had a full refurbishment and overhaul. I'm inclined to agree re scruffy & worn out, a prime example is the condition they've ran Class 142s in (Particularly Ex Northern Spirit ones) over the years, even Pacers that have had work done on them look in similar condition, I caught one of the class 144's today, to look at it you wouldn't have thought it had been 'refurbished' twice. Another thing I find poor with Northern is ticket inspections, it is becoming rarer on the journeys I travel on for an inspection to be done for each station, which of course is lost revenue, whilst that is bound to happen on busy trips and trips with short distances between stations there is little excuse on lightly loaded trains and for multiple stations, in some instances with two conductors on board as well. |
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